Post #101
This os true. Although he should have got rat boys engone and dump it in. well, thats what I'd have done. ________________________________________
See the sheer power and might of the lesser known burrowing owl.
|
| Author | Subject: spoilt brat needs opinon on engine modifications |
 aaron6
Seasoned Pro  Location: On the sofa in maidstone Registered: 16 May 2006 Posts: 5,840 Status: Offline |
|
 Posted 3rd Dec 2011 at 09:09
|
|
|
buzzbrightyear
Seasoned Pro  Location: hiding all receipts for car Registered: 09 Jul 2008 Posts: 11,894 Status: Offline |
Post #102
we all make mistakes I suppose, its how we learn. It's when we don't learn from them we have to worry!! ________________________________________ andrew315rawson@live.co.ukMoonstone phase 7 gti6 My Project thread: http://www.306gti6.com/forum/showthread.php?id=119992&page=1 |
|
Posted 3rd Dec 2011 at 09:46
|
|
|
daveyboy
aka Jim Davey  Location: Southampton Registered: 01 Oct 2007 Posts: 8,648 Status: Offline |
Post #103
aaron6 wrote: This os true. Although he should have got rat boys engone and dump it in. well, thats what I'd have done. Agreed, I almost wish I had grabbed it myself as a good spare. ________________________________________ R H Davey Welding Supplies. I sell new and used welding equipment in the Hampshire area. I take on welding jobs in the evenings, ally casting repairs are one of my specialities but I can weld pretty much anything. PM me with your requirements.Some of my services: (See my for sale threads) Engine mount/chassis repair Solid Beam Mounts BACK IN PRODUCTION Harness bars |
|
Posted 3rd Dec 2011 at 17:16
|
|
|
darzmat
Senior User  Location: nairn Registered: 14 Jan 2011 Posts: 879 Status: Offline |
Post #104
jimmyhackers wrote: i was told it was capped at 7000 in the phase 2 my ph2 revs to either 7250 or 7450, not driven it in a couple of months though so cant remember lol ________________________________________ 1997 blaze GTI-6 bought january '11 £800 Spend to date on parts £827.88 |
|
Posted 3rd Dec 2011 at 20:38
|
|
|
jimmyhackers
Seasoned Pro  Location: birmingham Registered: 14 Jun 2011 Posts: 1,112 Status: Offline |
Post #105
im giving up on spending on the engine for now. its not worth the money for a rebuild after ive been cleaned out as it were. new lighter seats, bonnet and windows with a few other mods will make the car exactly what i wanted it to be from the start. a goodlooking reliable light hot hatch that handles wellplus all these things can be easily transfered to a new car. the same way if i get an oil intercooler and an electric water pump. they too can easily be transfered to a new engine. things like uprated cams con rods or a full sc conversion is a little more time consuming. ________________________________________ the world is changed by people in sheds |
|
Posted 4th Dec 2011 at 01:36
|
|
|
owain
Seasoned Pro  Location: Essex Registered: 20 May 2009 Posts: 9,185 Status: Offline |
Post #106
Phew, that's a relief  Sounds like a much more sensible idea, exactly what I did with mine. The shell is a beaten up P1 shell, so I've been reluctant to do anything that couldn't be moved to another shell. Suspension, Lexan windows, oil coolers can all just be picked up and moved when the bottom of the car rusts to pieces. Mine's got a completely standard engine, and (touch wood) I've never had any real engine issues over many trackdays. Ridiculous engine mods are great when they work, but when they don't they'll cost you thousands unless you can do all the work yourself. Do suspension, brakes, windows, seats, wheels and possible a bolt-in cage. That'll last a long time before you get bored with it, then maybe consider doing something to the engine. ________________________________________ Membership expiring soon, get in contact on our new little forum project. |
|
Posted 4th Dec 2011 at 09:17
|
|
|
prism7guy
Seasoned Pro  Location: DoncastAAAAARGH Registered: 13 Jan 2008 Posts: 4,639 Status: Offline |
Post #107
Wouldnt an electric water pump simply remove the parasitic drag from the cambelt and cause the alternator to have extra drag? ________________________________________ Goldie the track car. |
|
Posted 4th Dec 2011 at 12:17
|
|
|
owain
Seasoned Pro Location: Essex Registered: 20 May 2009 Posts: 9,185 Status: Offline |
Post #108
And be more likely to fail I'd imagine.________________________________________ Membership expiring soon, get in contact on our new little forum project. |
|
Posted 4th Dec 2011 at 12:34
|
|
|
jimmyhackers
Seasoned Pro Location: birmingham Registered: 14 Jun 2011 Posts: 1,112 Status: Offline |
Post #109
prism7guy wrote: Wouldnt an electric water pump simply remove the parasitic drag from the cambelt and cause the alternator to have extra drag? http://www.daviescraig.com.au/ have a look at theri website, see what you think its all down to speculation really atm. the other things on my want list will probly be aquired first. my main concern is reliability/longevity. im interested in them becuase they seem a relatively new tech that not many people have looked into yet, im just interested (and willing) to "test" it out. the install seems fairly uncomplicated. involves plumbing the pump in low down. removing the original waterpumps impellars, removing the thermostat, wiring it in to new temp sensor and your old rad fan. bleeding the system. test drive  yes your right. however the electric water pump works as and when needed and far more efficiently than a mechanical pump. if im right its 15v at 10amps is 150w for the pumps max power and 15v at 12a is 180w for the controllers max power. so 330watts is max power taken. if im right thats 0.4ish bhp so lets take into acount the alt loses and call it 1bhp max. seeing as this does upto 5 litre engines i dont think ill be running anywhere near max current. i dont expect massive power gains or any noticable ones. what i hope for is a a much more efficient cooling system. as in i get to temp quicker (reduces engine wear) i dont suffer from hotspots on shutdown (runs on afterwards). sitting in traffic i wont overheat or need to put my heater matrix on full blast. with its increased cooling capacity theres a possibility for a smaller radiator to reduce front end weight and would leave extra grill space for an oil/forced induction intercooler it comes with a programable controller box that takes controll of the pump and your exsisting rad fan. so you can adjust it to run how you want or easily transfer it to another engine. this box also comes with a warning light tht you can extend to your dash board (most definately needed if im testing this one out) i have another mad crazy scheme going with my 1.4 atm to make a steam turbine generator powered by the hot exhaust gases to replace the alternator. this would negate all electrical systems power drains. so far ive got a constant 110psi of steam coming out a 1/16 outlet/nozzle. but due to lack of funds for some unknown reason  i cant afford the closed loop tesla turbine atm, which is pretty much all i need to continue. so currently i have a rather large kettle/steam cleaner and a pile of old but squeaky clean a/c unit bits.next step is probly a new lambda sensor (aim low) seats bonnet windows in that order ________________________________________ the world is changed by people in sheds |
|
Posted 4th Dec 2011 at 13:35
|
|
|
owain
Seasoned Pro Location: Essex Registered: 20 May 2009 Posts: 9,185 Status: Offline |
Post #110
Hmm, I think there's either some very flawed logic there or I'm missing something. When you say it "works as and when needed" - a water pump is *always* needed, else the water in the block will heat up and boil almost immediately and your block will crack. The idea of a water pump is to keep the water moving around the engine and so regulate the temperature, turning it off even for a few seconds could be disasterous. I wouldn't rely on a 150W pump to filter my pond, let alone move water reliably around a five litre engine, that just sounds ridiculous. Quite some pressure is needed to make sure water is pushed up through a block, out into the heater matrix and back again, I'm not sure I'd fancy anything other than the torque of an engine to do that for me. How will it get to temperature quicker? How will it stop you overheating in traffic? How does it have "increased cooling capacity"? It's a motor, not a radiator. It doesn't cool anything. Your radiator is responsible for cooling the water, so how is a different motor going to allow for a smaller radiator, which will in turn mean you won't overheat so much? Hmm. ________________________________________ Membership expiring soon, get in contact on our new little forum project. |
|
Posted 4th Dec 2011 at 13:58
|
|
|
phillipm
Seasoned Pro  Location: Rotherham Registered: 15 Oct 2006 Posts: 20,607 Status: Offline |
Post #111
It's like talking to a brick wall Owain, you'd be better off trying to turn Rikky straight.________________________________________ - Bespoke rollcages/additions/adjustments. Half cages right up to complete custom spaceframes - MSA/FIA spec, CDS, ROPT, T45, etc - PM meEmail me! Custom-made polybushes available - need an odd size or fitment? - anything from batch work to one-off pieces. |
|
Posted 4th Dec 2011 at 14:33
|
|
rikky
🦔 Location: cheshire Registered: 28 Feb 2004 Posts: 26,793 Status: Offline |
Post #112
oh no you didn't girl________________________________________ 306 rallye reproduction decals (full sets/individual decals) | 306 b-pillar textured vinyl weatherstrips306 slam panel esso stickers | 306 yellow / orange / pension fund red side door badges gti6 inlet manifold badges | 306 rear boot badges (p2/p3) winner of Extraction of toys from prams with outstanding vigour award 2009 [source: gti6 owners club] |
|
Posted 4th Dec 2011 at 14:34
|
|
|
owain
Seasoned Pro Location: Essex Registered: 20 May 2009 Posts: 9,185 Status: Offline |
Post #113
phillipm wrote: you'd be better off trying to turn Rikky straight. Jesus, in that case I plain and simple give up. Hopefully he'll concentrate on his flux capacitor idea instead then. ________________________________________ Membership expiring soon, get in contact on our new little forum project. |
|
Posted 4th Dec 2011 at 14:36
|
|
|
phillipm
Seasoned Pro Location: Rotherham Registered: 15 Oct 2006 Posts: 20,607 Status: Offline |
Post #114
rikky wrote: oh no you didn't girl  Seriously, the pump on the rotary only takes 3bhp, so a touch over 2kw, at 6000rpm (I know that 'cause the belt snapped on the dyno) and that's a pump that has to deal with idling at 900rpm and full chat of 9krpm+ So, gti6 pump pushing enough water to cool 100bhp less and dealing with lots less revs....how much do you reckon that absorbs...  Not sure where this magic 10kw gain is going to arrive from, bar magic fairy dust. And advertising bumph. ________________________________________ - Bespoke rollcages/additions/adjustments. Half cages right up to complete custom spaceframes - MSA/FIA spec, CDS, ROPT, T45, etc - PM meEmail me! Custom-made polybushes available - need an odd size or fitment? - anything from batch work to one-off pieces. |
|
Posted 4th Dec 2011 at 14:45
|
|
|
owain
Seasoned Pro Location: Essex Registered: 20 May 2009 Posts: 9,185 Status: Offline |
Post #115
phillipm wrote: Not sure where this magic 10kw gain is going to arrive from, bar magic fairy dust. And advertising bumph. Maybe that's the gain when coupled with an electric supercharger? ________________________________________ Membership expiring soon, get in contact on our new little forum project. |
|
Posted 4th Dec 2011 at 14:47
|
|
|
jimmyhackers
Seasoned Pro Location: birmingham Registered: 14 Jun 2011 Posts: 1,112 Status: Offline |
Post #116
its almost like when they replaced belt driven fans with electric ones. its not running when it doesnt need to be. however this pump is always running and works on a duty cycle so the speed will ramp up if needed. this means your cars coolant can be managed more effectivly. the oem water pumps main limitation is its link to engine speed. great as you get more cooling at higher revs. however if you go from a stonking it around to sitting idling in traffic your engine block is still very hot and your pump is running at its slowest. the same way if its a hot day and your sitting in traffic your oem water pump is running at its lowest hence some people putting on the heaters as a backup. this same limitation of being linked to engine speed means the pump design on most cars is a happy medium (gives more than adequate flow throughout rev range) whcih means its inefficent your cooling system also relys almost soley on the thermostatic valve to regulate tempreture. i would hope an electronic system would be able to maintain a constant 90 degrees better this is one of the last things on my wish list right now. and i wont mention it further untill ive gone and done it probably in a year or two (after ive finacially recovered )________________________________________ the world is changed by people in sheds |
|
Posted 4th Dec 2011 at 15:01
|
|
|
owain
Seasoned Pro Location: Essex Registered: 20 May 2009 Posts: 9,185 Status: Offline |
Post #117
jimmyhackers wrote: if its a hot day and your sitting in traffic your oem water pump is running at its lowest hence some people putting on the heaters as a backup. Rubbish. If you're in traffic the engine overheats because there's no cool air coming into the rad, not because your water isn't moving quickly enough. ________________________________________ Membership expiring soon, get in contact on our new little forum project. |
|
Posted 4th Dec 2011 at 15:06
|
|
|
phillipm
Seasoned Pro Location: Rotherham Registered: 15 Oct 2006 Posts: 20,607 Status: Offline |
Post #118
^What he said, nucleatic boiling takes care of any hot spots and those don't reappear because the engine is making bugger all heat anyway.________________________________________ - Bespoke rollcages/additions/adjustments. Half cages right up to complete custom spaceframes - MSA/FIA spec, CDS, ROPT, T45, etc - PM meEmail me! Custom-made polybushes available - need an odd size or fitment? - anything from batch work to one-off pieces. |
|
Posted 4th Dec 2011 at 15:11
|
|
|
jimmyhackers
Seasoned Pro Location: birmingham Registered: 14 Jun 2011 Posts: 1,112 Status: Offline |
Post #119
owain wrote: jimmyhackers wrote: if its a hot day and your sitting in traffic your oem water pump is running at its lowest hence some people putting on the heaters as a backup. Rubbish. If you're in traffic the engine overheats because there's no cool air coming into the rad, not because your water isn't moving quickly enough. yourt right i didnt explain properly. the electric controll box takes over controll of your rad fan aswell. this is one of the reasons it can maintain your coolant temp better i.e. when your sitting still it can run the pump hgigher or choose to switch the fan on. the box is fully programable so you can decided on pump duty cycles, coolant target temps and fan on temps, how long you want the pump to run on for after engine shutdown. ________________________________________ the world is changed by people in sheds |
|
Posted 4th Dec 2011 at 15:26
|
|
|
owain
Seasoned Pro Location: Essex Registered: 20 May 2009 Posts: 9,185 Status: Offline |
Post #120
Okay then, you fill yer boots sunshine. I'll look forward to the "new block required, will pay up to £4000" post when it inevitably fails.________________________________________ Membership expiring soon, get in contact on our new little forum project. |
|
Posted 4th Dec 2011 at 15:32
|
|
|
jimmyhackers
Seasoned Pro Location: birmingham Registered: 14 Jun 2011 Posts: 1,112 Status: Offline |
Post #121
youll be waiting at least a year for that joy. many other things right now are higher priority on the wish list________________________________________ the world is changed by people in sheds |
|
Posted 4th Dec 2011 at 15:37
|
|
|
jimmyhackers
Seasoned Pro Location: birmingham Registered: 14 Jun 2011 Posts: 1,112 Status: Offline |
Post #122
argh theres a phase one v6 on ebay. i should just get that ________________________________________ the world is changed by people in sheds |
|
Posted 4th Dec 2011 at 22:27
|
|
|
ballardpaul
Seasoned Pro  Location: Croydon Registered: 22 Jul 2008 Posts: 4,135 Status: Offline |
Post #123
Do it and move all your shiny bits over ________________________________________ Phase 2 Blaze GTi 6 (Standard) SoldPhase 3 Supercharged China GTi 6 (249.8 BHP) Sold Phase 3 Supercharged Diablo GTi 6 (443 BHP)Sold Nissan 350Z (300 BHP) |
|
Posted 4th Dec 2011 at 23:20
|
|
|
7057sam
Seasoned Pro  Location: Stowmarket,Suffolk Registered: 18 Apr 2009 Posts: 2,080 Status: Offline |
Post #124
Maybe you should just go back to smoking weed !________________________________________ Rallye build: 11 November 1998 - a WednesdayTeam rallye,built for track ----Click this if you like rallyes Rallye dead  Secret Team Astor... |
|
Posted 5th Dec 2011 at 00:26
|
|
|
owain
Seasoned Pro Location: Essex Registered: 20 May 2009 Posts: 9,185 Status: Offline |
Post #125
Get the V6, throw the engine away, build up a new V6 from parts from Peugeot and fit that ________________________________________ Membership expiring soon, get in contact on our new little forum project. |
|
Posted 5th Dec 2011 at 07:56
|
|
The Peugeot GTi-6 & Rallye Owners Club - ©2024 all rights reserved.
Please Note: The views and opinions found herein are those of individuals, and not of The Peugeot 306 GTi-6 & Rallye Owners Club or any individuals involved.
No responsibility is taken or assumed for any comments or statements made on, or in relation to, this website. Please see our updated privacy policy.