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Author Subject: Possible to skim engine block?
miki4

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Location: Cologne

Registered: 09 Nov 2015

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Post #1
Hello everyone,

I took apart my old broken engine with 160k miles on it and am very surprised that the cams and bores virtually look like new. I thought the block had a crack between cylinder 3/4 but it's only the HG which went between said cylinders so I want to rescue the engine and give it an overhaul. Cylinder 4 is also very clean - I guess it burnt some coolant there. I did not inspect the crank shaft so far but I guess it is also in good shape.

The thing is that there is some material gone on the block between those cylinders / there is a flat area. Is it possible to skim the block to get a nice and even surface for the headgasket or will I run into problems doing so? AFAIK the head has never been skimmed before.

Another s**t is that somehow the cam belt skipped a tooth. Therefore I could not lock the cam pulleys and crank in place at the same time before taking off the cam belt (crank pulley has NOT slipped). Instead of fixing the cam pulleys into position and then taking off the cam belt, I only fixed the crank on the flywheel side before I took off the belt. I thought, somehow I would manage to just rotate the cam pulleys back by hand and then fix them. Roll eyes Wasn't very careful as I thought the engine was fuked anyway. Guess what happened. Whistle Both cam pulleys forcefully turned to the right...When I took off the head, I could not see any marks on the valves and pistons. Am I lucky or is it impossible that the valves have not touched the pistons?

Here some pics:

Posted 1st Jun 2017 at 17:22
welshpug!

Capt Pedantic

Location: Bigend, Wales.

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Post #2
I think I would be getting another engine, anything is possible but it'll be a lot of machine time

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Posted 1st Jun 2017 at 17:59
phillipm

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Post #3
My local place charges the same to skim a block as he does a head, he did our S2000 block when I rebuilt it to go in the buggy.

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Posted 1st Jun 2017 at 20:41
miki4

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Post #4
Thanks for the answers. Let's say machine time and cost would not matter. Is it generally possible to skim a GTI6 engine block or would you scrape off some vital profile of the mating surface?
Posted 2nd Jun 2017 at 00:10
welshpug!

Capt Pedantic

Location: Bigend, Wales.

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Post #5
yes its perfectly possible, main issue is reducing the deck height and therefore the valve clearance.

its called decking the block.

another typical issue with a block with that many miles on it is the bores will be worn out, especially when the HG goes and washes the oil away and runs the piston rings dry on the bores.

you can see the shiny bore with the cleaner piston is oval, there's a larger gap on the thrust face.


if the block has a groove I'd hazard a guess that the head will also, which will need welding as you can't remove more than 0.2mm safely (standard head is 137mm, min height 136.8 +/- 0.05)

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Posted 2nd Jun 2017 at 07:43
miki4

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Post #6
Late answer as my membership ran out but now renewed. Thumbs up

That sounds good. The larger gap in the clean cylinder is an optical illusion as I poured some oil on the bores before cranking the engine and it collected there. The bores are perfectly fine. No scores, no large gaps and continuous honed finish in all cylinders.

If I needed to take away 0.3 mm from both the block and the head to get a flat surface avoiding welding. Is there a special head gasket that can make up for the loss of clearance?
Posted 13th Jun 2017 at 13:27
welshpug!

Capt Pedantic

Location: Bigend, Wales.

Registered: 27 Mar 2007

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Post #7
there is only a +0.2mm gasket, so if your cylinder head has also been skimmed you may need the pistons machined.

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Posted 13th Jun 2017 at 13:44
miki4

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Post #8
Okay thanks, I'll see when I have time and money left for a rebuild. If it's too much meat it could aswell be an excuse to get hold of a charger and go high boost. LOL
Posted 13th Jun 2017 at 13:54
miki4

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Post #9
Topic revival Smile

What's the main reason one may only take away 0.2 mm from the head (respectively block)? Is it piston-to-valve clearance or the higher compression ratio which would lead to knock or maybe something else?

Would it suffice to enlargen the valve cutouts in the pistons to be able to take more meat off the block or head than 0.2 mm? I would not mind a slightly higher compression ratio as I'm running LPG anyway.
Posted 15th Jun 2019 at 00:52
prism7guy

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Post #10
As far as i know it's just valve-piston clearance.

The head in my track car had .75mm skimmed off a couple of years ago, to counteract that i had the pistons pocketed 1mm and the engine runs fine with no taps or untoward noises.
Not really ideal though seeing as it's boosted DohLaugh

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Posted 15th Jun 2019 at 01:05
rudolf

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Post #11
I think on a new enginw there is only 2mm clearance

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Posted 15th Jun 2019 at 09:00
welshpug!

Capt Pedantic

Location: Bigend, Wales.

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Post #12
the valve seats are really close to the face of the head, also with an inclined valve they will get closer to the side of rhe valve cutout the more you skim.

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Posted 15th Jun 2019 at 11:58
welshpug!

Capt Pedantic

Location: Bigend, Wales.

Registered: 27 Mar 2007

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Post #13
prism7guy wrote:
As far as i know it's just valve-piston clearance.

The head in my track car had .75mm skimmed off a couple of years ago, to counteract that i had the pistons pocketed 1mm and the engine runs fine with no taps or untoward noises.
Not really ideal though seeing as it's boosted DohLaugh



nloody ell!!

1mm on a cutout makes far less difference than a 0.75mm skim im sure!!

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Posted 15th Jun 2019 at 12:00
prism7guy

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Post #14
Yeah, i did the trig and had the cutouts on the piston moved out a bit too so there was still enough clearance for the outer edges of the vavles.

I also skimmed a tiny bit off the faces of the vavles too to try and help (~.25mm from memory), far from ideal but i've not had a single issue since and the engine gets a proper work-out every time i take it on track.

In the future i think i'm going to source another standard engine and stick it in the track car and retire this one into the 205 on a set of throttle bodies. The compression ratio must be pretty high now LOL

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Posted 16th Jun 2019 at 00:47
miki4

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Post #15
Thanks for the answers guys! Thumbs up

Is there a special way of enlargening the cutouts? I can imagine doing that with a Dremel and a steady hand but don't know if slight irregularities would affect compression ratio and combustion between cylinders too much.
Posted 16th Jun 2019 at 13:11
prism7guy

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Post #16
Best off doing it with a proper milling machine i'd say.

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Posted 16th Jun 2019 at 22:22

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