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displaying posts 1 to 25 of 28
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| Author | Subject: heating on the blink |
 jimmyhackers
Seasoned Pro  Location: birmingham Registered: 14 Jun 2011 Posts: 1,090 Status: Offline |
Post #1
Hello all.Wen driving along my car sits at 75degrees and the heater matrix is Luke warm. When sitting in traffic or a takeaway. My tempreture slowly rises but my heater matrix blows cold. Matrix is bled properly. Thermostat is 3months old. Any ideas? ________________________________________ the world is changed by people in sheds |
 Posted 10th Mar 2015 at 16:13
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rikky
🦔 Location: cheshire Registered: 28 Feb 2004 Posts: 26,793 Status: Offline |
Post #2
would still go with air lock / thermostat. chuck it in a pan of boiling water and see if it's working / seal's ok on it________________________________________ 306 rallye reproduction decals (full sets/individual decals) | 306 b-pillar textured vinyl weatherstrips306 slam panel esso stickers | 306 yellow / orange / pension fund red side door badges gti6 inlet manifold badges | 306 rear boot badges (p2/p3) winner of Extraction of toys from prams with outstanding vigour award 2009 [source: gti6 owners club] |
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Posted 10th Mar 2015 at 16:17
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adam b
Seasoned Pro  Location: The Nam Registered: 24 Jan 2006 Posts: 12,828 Status: Offline |
Post #3
Split in the matrix allowing air in________________________________________ Nothing to see here |
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Posted 10th Mar 2015 at 20:46
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armzsc6
Seasoned Pro  Location: Crowborough Registered: 22 Mar 2008 Posts: 3,445 Status: Offline |
Post #4
Either not bled properly (use a hose or water bottle in the top of the rad to raise the level up much higher than top of the matrix) or head gasket faliure.... Had quite a few cars in the past where heater blows hot then cold then hot and it's because of exhaust gasses in the coolant which will go to the highest place which can often be the matrix. No other symptoms? ________________________________________ Black power baby! SUUUUUPERCHARGED Seat Leon FR TDI 190BHP 300lbft daily gti-6 killer :p 12x 306's owned so far Cambelts, clutches, service work carried out on All makes and models, Peugeot Citroen / mitsubishi specialist. Pug planet / Citroen Lexia diagnostics / code reads available. |
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Posted 10th Mar 2015 at 21:33
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jimmyhackers
Seasoned Pro Location: birmingham Registered: 14 Jun 2011 Posts: 1,090 Status: Offline |
Post #5
hm.... i hate the idea of a broken heater matrix and worse a head gasket.no other symptoms. car runs sweet as a nut. my coolant level isnt dropping which made me think its not a leak somewhere. only other weird thing about the car is. it was a twim fan aircon model and now i have a single fan and no aircon rad to block the engine radiator. meaning my rads extra exposed i asked about this in an earlier thread. after doing this "modification" my average engine temp dropped from the mid 80s to the low 70's whist driving along. making my heatmatix blow luke warm. i tried replacing my thermostat then to no avail (if aything it it a little colder). its only in the past few month ive noticed it blow cold when sitting around in traffic either way i asked if there was a different aircon and non aircon thermostat as the one i replaced with was pretty different looking to the one i removed. but i was assured it was correct. at the shop i bought it and on here that theres only "one thermostat for the 306" are you guys sure there isnt a non aircon thermostat???? despite teh whacking great differnce in radiator exposure of a aircon and non aircon 306 ________________________________________ the world is changed by people in sheds |
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Posted 11th Mar 2015 at 09:28
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jeffers
Forum Admin Location: Leeds Registered: 14 Dec 2003 Posts: 3,702 Status: Offline |
Post #6
My Aircon is removed and I see no temperature difference...________________________________________ Team Running Engine again!Team Negative Camber! My Budget track engine build thread! Now appearing at a Trackday near you!!  |
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Posted 11th Mar 2015 at 16:59
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barrym
Senior User  Location: Westcliff-on-sea Registered: 26 Jun 2014 Posts: 502 Status: Offline |
Post #7
The radiator can only cool what the thermostat lets through. Mine ran cold when my thermostat was stuck open, the rubber seal, round the edge of the thermostat not the housing, had come loose and jammed it open. Took longer to warm up and stuck at about 75 degrees on a run.Swap your thermostat again,preferably for a OE one. Mine was about £21 from Pug but comes with peace of mind thrown in. Now just below the 85 degree mark on the gauge and blows hot air very quickly ________________________________________ China D Turbo HDi daily chargerBlack Rallye occassional toy |
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Posted 11th Mar 2015 at 17:17
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buzzbrightyear
Seasoned Pro  Location: hiding all receipts for car Registered: 09 Jul 2008 Posts: 11,894 Status: Offline |
Post #8
Is the matrix running freely, ie not blocked??________________________________________ andrew315rawson@live.co.ukMoonstone phase 7 gti6 My Project thread: http://www.306gti6.com/forum/showthread.php?id=119992&page=1 |
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Posted 11th Mar 2015 at 17:56
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jimmyhackers
Seasoned Pro Location: birmingham Registered: 14 Jun 2011 Posts: 1,090 Status: Offline |
Post #9
jeffers wrote: My Aircon is removed and I see no temperature difference... with a single fan also? maybe this makes the difference? i saw at least a 10 degree drop in temps from removing mine and going to a single fan. non-aircons had a single fan as standard. i think the fact the fans on the passenger side instead of the driver side could be effecting things. either that or two dodgey thermostats in a row. : s (probably more likely this) nope to the blocked matrix. flow is good when opening all three drain plugs and engine is running. not sure how else to check matrix for blockages. i dont think its a blockage, my coolants always been pretty dam clean in this one. just to check......i remeber the new thermostat i put in had its spring "off centre" by design. its tempretures were the same as what was needed. maybe ive been sold the wrong thermo from the off. could be openign at the right temps but too much or it off centre design is impeeding flow somehow actually thinking about it a dodgey thermostat (sticking open=cold engine) would be made worse by a cooler radiator. is ther a possibility that a dodgey thermostat could also make it so when i was at idle for a time the temps would rise quickly but the heater matrix would go cold. maybe its blocking off flow to the matrix when fully open? thats the weird thing about it... cold engine = warm blower, hot engine = cold blower :S ________________________________________ the world is changed by people in sheds |
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Posted 11th Mar 2015 at 22:37
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buzzbrightyear
Seasoned Pro Location: hiding all receipts for car Registered: 09 Jul 2008 Posts: 11,894 Status: Offline |
Post #10
Take the hoses off the matrix on the bulkhead, put hose pipe on matrix and see what waters flowing out like,I seem to remember that you had a sludgy cooling issue in the White t reg phase 3 a while back and had to replace the engine after it seized up or sonthing along them lines?? ________________________________________ andrew315rawson@live.co.ukMoonstone phase 7 gti6 My Project thread: http://www.306gti6.com/forum/showthread.php?id=119992&page=1 |
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Posted 12th Mar 2015 at 08:57
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jimmyhackers
Seasoned Pro Location: birmingham Registered: 14 Jun 2011 Posts: 1,090 Status: Offline |
Post #11
hm...... never owned a phase 3, the current xsi which the current problem is with is a phase 3.all my others have been wonderful and lovely phase 1's. a white 1.4 a, white gti and a black/blue gti. not sure if i ever mentioned that :s i get the feeling either your misinformed (same story but a phase 1) or the person who replaced my engine (in the phase one) has been having a giggle behind my back, as he too had something to mention about the brown water in my radaitor. was the kick up my arse i needed maybe. i make sure my coolants super clean in all my cars now. checked matrix its not blocked : S im gonna try a new thermostat from pug themselves. ________________________________________ the world is changed by people in sheds |
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Posted 12th Mar 2015 at 15:52
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buzzbrightyear
Seasoned Pro Location: hiding all receipts for car Registered: 09 Jul 2008 Posts: 11,894 Status: Offline |
Post #12
I mean the white phase 1 t reg ex silverstone one?________________________________________ andrew315rawson@live.co.ukMoonstone phase 7 gti6 My Project thread: http://www.306gti6.com/forum/showthread.php?id=119992&page=1 |
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Posted 12th Mar 2015 at 15:56
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rikky
🦔 Location: cheshire Registered: 28 Feb 2004 Posts: 26,793 Status: Offline |
Post #13
i've never bought a dealer thermostat but most you get from like ECP or Andrew Page are good quality replacements with decent branding. try bleeding it again and blowing through the overflow pipe. philipm taught me that many years ago and i always bleed it that way now if i'm having problems________________________________________ 306 rallye reproduction decals (full sets/individual decals) | 306 b-pillar textured vinyl weatherstrips306 slam panel esso stickers | 306 yellow / orange / pension fund red side door badges gti6 inlet manifold badges | 306 rear boot badges (p2/p3) winner of Extraction of toys from prams with outstanding vigour award 2009 [source: gti6 owners club] |
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Posted 12th Mar 2015 at 16:18
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jimmyhackers
Seasoned Pro Location: birmingham Registered: 14 Jun 2011 Posts: 1,090 Status: Offline |
Post #14
yep t reg silverstone was rather a nasty brown colour in the water. lessons learned albeit an expensive ones  hm..... never heard that one before. you mean the rad overflow pipe right? the one right by the rad cap? is it as simple as blow on that and open bleed valves? ________________________________________ the world is changed by people in sheds |
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Posted 12th Mar 2015 at 23:25
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jimmyhackers
Seasoned Pro Location: birmingham Registered: 14 Jun 2011 Posts: 1,090 Status: Offline |
Post #15
ARGH!!!!.....to some extent. took out the "new" thermostat, has 88c on it. (pretty sure this is wrong thermo)  replaced it with the old thermostat which has 83c on it (tested in boiling water open n closes) probably still need replacing. car sits at around the same tempreture again and still has the same problem. further thing ive noticed.....heater matrix does its cold thing if the engines sat somewhere below 2000rpm past that the flow to it seems to increase and it heats up. this a thermostat problem still? ________________________________________ the world is changed by people in sheds |
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Posted 19th Mar 2015 at 15:41
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jimmyhackers
Seasoned Pro Location: birmingham Registered: 14 Jun 2011 Posts: 1,090 Status: Offline |
Post #16
also noticed my rad hose's dont seem to "pressurize" they're all squishy : sthey are all hot including the send and return to my heater matrix, but squishy. water pumps lost pressure perhaps???? kinda hoping not i didnt think this initially as each bleed screw has a nice flow out of it when opened. then again i know the thermostats old (opening early) which would bypass pressure from the matrix (is this the case?) seems weird though if it is. As when engines up to tempreture wouldnt the thermostat be open and yet again be bypassing pressure to the matrix? also this is an xsi not a gti, are the thermostats differenet opening times between the models? thanks for the help so far, hopefully i figure something out ________________________________________ the world is changed by people in sheds |
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Posted 19th Mar 2015 at 17:23
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buzzbrightyear
Seasoned Pro Location: hiding all receipts for car Registered: 09 Jul 2008 Posts: 11,894 Status: Offline |
Post #17
it's not the flap that controls the heat setting that's not opening up is it?I Definatly don't think its the thermostat and if both matrix pipes are red hot and you've checked the flow coming out of the matrix and everything else is misbehaving eg eg it doesn't sound like a coolant issue. ________________________________________ andrew315rawson@live.co.ukMoonstone phase 7 gti6 My Project thread: http://www.306gti6.com/forum/showthread.php?id=119992&page=1 |
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Posted 19th Mar 2015 at 17:33
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jimmyhackers
Seasoned Pro Location: birmingham Registered: 14 Jun 2011 Posts: 1,090 Status: Offline |
Post #18
I don't think its the heater flap selector thing. I can hear it change between hot n cold. Also when my heater does decide to blow hot(Luke warm) I can switch it to cold and its cold and vice versa. Can the flap be half working?I thinks its a combination of low pressure water pump being exasperbated by a duff thermostat. When I get a proper working thermo in it. If my problem is lessened then pumps on its way out I guess. If it changes nothing then I don't know what's up : ( ________________________________________ the world is changed by people in sheds |
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Posted 19th Mar 2015 at 20:08
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welshpug!
Capt Pedantic  Location: Bigend, Wales. Registered: 27 Mar 2007 Posts: 25,817 Status: Offline |
Post #19
needs more coolant and bleeding properly by the sound of it.the pump doesn't make pressure it just moves the coolant in a closed loop. ________________________________________ need a part number? get on here - http://public.servicebox.peugeot.comBring on the Trumpets. |
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Posted 19th Mar 2015 at 20:16
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jimmyhackers
Seasoned Pro Location: birmingham Registered: 14 Jun 2011 Posts: 1,090 Status: Offline |
Post #20
iver bled it numerous times, numerous methods, ive had a heater matrix airlock before and got rid of it "easily" i really dont think this is an airlock. my matrix has good flow.without a haines manual i cant really tell if my xsi takes the same thermostat as the gti.(can someone check this with a haines please??) the one from carspares (suposedly for the xsi) opens at 88c and has a weird bypas valve in it unlike a gti which opens at 83c and doesnt have a bypass valve thing. both have been fitted and both make my engine run cold when moving (75 degrees) and make my heater matrix blow cold when moving. on the flip side both thermostats when stationary have made my engine get to temp (90 degrees) but made my heater matrix blow cold. this would/should ring alarm bells (kinda does) that its not a thermostat problem but bear with me...... the loop for the heater matrix on my xsi pretty much couples straight onto the thermostat housing. meaning when the thermostats open whatever flow round my engine/heater matrix is partially diverted from the heater matrix to the radiator. i say "hopefullY" both thermostats are faulty/incorrect, which would seem the case as my engines pretty cold. meaning the thermos open way before my engine internals and heater matrix are up to temp, which bypasses a majority of the flow to the matrix, meaning my engine (and heater matrix) never really reach temp. at a higher rpm my water pump is spinning faster (more flow) so i get enough flow to keep the matrix hot. but when at idle it hasnt enough flow to make a difference the matrix. can someone crack out a haines please (put some of my fears to rest) and let me know what/if there is a difference between an xsi and a gti thermostat. thanks again ________________________________________ the world is changed by people in sheds |
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Posted 20th Mar 2015 at 11:58
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rikky
🦔 Location: cheshire Registered: 28 Feb 2004 Posts: 26,793 Status: Offline |
Post #21
has your thermostat got the black rubber seal around the outside?________________________________________ 306 rallye reproduction decals (full sets/individual decals) | 306 b-pillar textured vinyl weatherstrips306 slam panel esso stickers | 306 yellow / orange / pension fund red side door badges gti6 inlet manifold badges | 306 rear boot badges (p2/p3) winner of Extraction of toys from prams with outstanding vigour award 2009 [source: gti6 owners club] |
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Posted 20th Mar 2015 at 12:14
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welshpug!
Capt Pedantic Location: Bigend, Wales. Registered: 27 Mar 2007 Posts: 25,817 Status: Offline |
Post #22
same 83 degree on a 16v xsi as the gti6, same bleed points.its HAYNES not haines. ________________________________________ need a part number? get on here - http://public.servicebox.peugeot.comBring on the Trumpets. |
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Posted 20th Mar 2015 at 13:30
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jimmyhackers
Seasoned Pro Location: birmingham Registered: 14 Jun 2011 Posts: 1,090 Status: Offline |
Post #23
thanks welsh......could be thermo then.also yes rubber ring seal is there. looks like im off to the parts centre for new thermo of correct value then. will report back here on results ________________________________________ the world is changed by people in sheds |
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Posted 20th Mar 2015 at 19:03
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jimmyhackers
Seasoned Pro Location: birmingham Registered: 14 Jun 2011 Posts: 1,090 Status: Offline |
Post #24
new thermo from carspares. right size and temp.bas**rd problem still remains. car sits at low temp(just under 80 now) while driving with luke warm heaters. when stationary engine goes up in temp but heaters go cold. im starting to think its something to do with the XSI being a cheap knock off of the gti. same block but with much missing. inluding the thermostat housing regulator thingy that the gti has. heres a question....see the thermostat pictures above.....should the valve part seal have an oring on it (not the main outside oring seal)? if it did and now doesnt, it could mean its somewhere inside my engine being gay ________________________________________ the world is changed by people in sheds |
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Posted 28th Mar 2015 at 14:51
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jimmyhackers
Seasoned Pro Location: birmingham Registered: 14 Jun 2011 Posts: 1,090 Status: Offline |
Post #25
i have solved my problem... to some extent.i put a power ball dishwasher tab in my expansion tank and waited about a week. drained my water but it was still nie on clear and non dripping. took my compressor with tyre pump gun to the heater matrix drain plug and blasted it with compressed air. about another litre of rather muddy brown looking water came out my rad drain plug. was weird as i still got a good flow through the matrix beforehand. so it wasnt blocked.....but more so coated/insulated with crud. im guessing as the matrix is the highest point in the cooling system all contaminents float to here and collect themselves. i figure normal gravity when emptying the coolant system must not be enough to suck out the matrix contents (even with the drain plug undone) however a compressor gun has the beans to push it out... now my car is nearly normal again. it still runs very cold around and under 80degrees. but the heater matrix is blowing lovely hot air all the time  ________________________________________ the world is changed by people in sheds |
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Posted 28th Apr 2015 at 17:34
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