displaying posts 1 to 25 of 25

Author Subject: Engine options
si_batt

Newbie

Location: Warwick

Registered: 01 Jan 1970

Posts: 39

Status: Offline

Post #1
Hi all,

I'm hoping someone might be able to help me out with a little advice on the following questions please:

1) Does a 2.1 conversion (88mm crank and 87mm pistons) make a noticeable difference to the performance of a GTi-6 engine?

2) How does the GTi-6 engine compare, in terms of the mid range performance (i.e. 2500 - 3500 rpm) to the XSi 8v?

The reason I ask this is that I own a Phase 1 XSi 8v that my brother and I have owned for the last 8 years, and I am considering putting a GTi-6 engine in the car, as it would clearly make the car quite a bit faster. However, one of the things I love about the XSi 8v is the great driveability, and the fact that it has plenty of torque in the mid speed range, which is where I drive it most of the time, and this is something I'd prefer not to sacrifice. But having never driven a GTi-6, I've no real idea of whether this is likely to be a problem or not? I did once drive a standard XSi 16v and didn't really like it as it was no quicker at top end than my 8v (which is slightly modified to about the same bhp as an XSi 16v) but was quite a bit worse in the mid range.

Thanks in advance to anyone that can offer any advice on this!
Posted 15th Oct 2012 at 12:59
stan_306gti6 Forum Admin

Location: Kent

Registered: 18 Jan 2004

Posts: 21,768

Status: Offline

Post #2
Hi,

1) Yes, it will make a big difference to the performance should you carry out that modification. Yes

2) The drivability of the '6' engine is far superior to the XSi 8v. The midrange torque you will probably find about the same but the pull is a lot, lot greater. In a nutshell, if you go down the route of installing a '6' engine you won't be disappointed. Big grin

________________________________________

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Peugeot 306 GTi-6
2000 (X), Moonstone Love
Posted 15th Oct 2012 at 16:15
welshpug!

Capt Pedantic

Location: Bigend, Wales.

Registered: 27 Mar 2007

Posts: 25,817

Status: Offline

Post #3
the 6 beats the 8v around the head with its extra torque.

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Posted 15th Oct 2012 at 17:28
si_batt

Newbie

Location: Warwick

Registered: 01 Jan 1970

Posts: 39

Status: Offline

Post #4
Great, thanks for the info. Sounds like a 6 engine is the way forwards then. A winter project could be on the cards!
Posted 15th Oct 2012 at 18:20
eliotrw

Seasoned Pro

Location: Southwark

Registered: 18 Jul 2010

Posts: 4,864

Status: Offline

Post #5
Matty rallyes 2.1 looks mental on paper so i can only assume its ridiculous in real life. What is it something like 190 at the WHEELS ?? Shock
Costs lots of $$$ though...

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Ex- Phase 3 China GTi-6 T-Reg
Posted 15th Oct 2012 at 18:57
eliotrw

Seasoned Pro

Location: Southwark

Registered: 18 Jul 2010

Posts: 4,864

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Post #6
Just checked 226hp and 177lbft At the fly

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Ex- Phase 3 China GTi-6 T-Reg
Posted 15th Oct 2012 at 19:00
honestly3k

Seasoned Pro

Location: Berkhamsted

Registered: 06 Apr 2009

Posts: 2,390

Status: Offline

Post #7
I have always wondered about what is involved in building a 2.1 engined 6 and what the costs would be - anyone in the know care to add some more to this query? Big grin

________________________________________

''Oh, it does handle like a golf!'' Why drive a Golf....when you can drive a GTi-6?
Posted 15th Oct 2012 at 19:01
welshpug!

Capt Pedantic

Location: Bigend, Wales.

Registered: 27 Mar 2007

Posts: 25,817

Status: Offline

Post #8
to do it properly you need decent rods and pistons, that'll set you back about £1200, the rest is standard fare rebuild parts.

that'd be using an 88mm crank from any 1.9 XU or XUD, there is the other option of using a 92mm XUD11 crank and going 2.2.

either route can give very impressive results even with mild or standard cams.

________________________________________

need a part number? get on here - http://public.servicebox.peugeot.com

Bring on the Trumpets.

Posted 15th Oct 2012 at 19:06
eliotrw

Seasoned Pro

Location: Southwark

Registered: 18 Jul 2010

Posts: 4,864

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Post #9
Need tbs too to get the most from it as well dont you? And therefore aftermarket management?

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Ex- Phase 3 China GTi-6 T-Reg
Posted 15th Oct 2012 at 19:07
welshpug!

Capt Pedantic

Location: Bigend, Wales.

Registered: 27 Mar 2007

Posts: 25,817

Status: Offline

Post #10
You don't NEED itb's, but you do need either a map or aftermarket ecu.

________________________________________

need a part number? get on here - http://public.servicebox.peugeot.com

Bring on the Trumpets.

Posted 15th Oct 2012 at 19:11
eliotrw

Seasoned Pro

Location: Southwark

Registered: 18 Jul 2010

Posts: 4,864

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Post #11
Ah ok. My mistake. Has anyone actually done a 2.2 on here, Do we know?
Would be interested to see the torque figures. I assume it would end up as NA on par with a s/c conversion?

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Ex- Phase 3 China GTi-6 T-Reg
Posted 15th Oct 2012 at 19:16
honestly3k

Seasoned Pro

Location: Berkhamsted

Registered: 06 Apr 2009

Posts: 2,390

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Post #12
So in theory you are probably talking circa 2.5k for parts, machining and labour for someone to build it?

Or is that an underestimate? I always thought you got some really impressive gains from what i have seen/read on here.

Makes me wonder why people go for cams/itb's and a remap when doing it this way would in theory be similar cash for a better outcome

________________________________________

''Oh, it does handle like a golf!'' Why drive a Golf....when you can drive a GTi-6?
Posted 15th Oct 2012 at 19:22
eliotrw

Seasoned Pro

Location: Southwark

Registered: 18 Jul 2010

Posts: 4,864

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Post #13
I would have thought 3 plus?
Pistons and rods 1.2-1.4k
Crank ???
Realistically cams too 300
Gaskets (inlet/exhaust/head/stat etc etc) 150+
Various seals (stem , Cam shaft crank etc etc) 100+
Bearings 80?
Head skim and machining not a clue but a few hundred at least
management just under a grand
plus labour
Plus mapping
You wont want a standard exhaust either if you dont want one.

________________________________________

Ex- Phase 3 China GTi-6 T-Reg
Posted 15th Oct 2012 at 19:50
welshpug!

Capt Pedantic

Location: Bigend, Wales.

Registered: 27 Mar 2007

Posts: 25,817

Status: Offline

Post #14
Crank, I got an 88mm one free, paid £40 for the 92mm.
Cam's PeterT regrind from about £120, to new blanks £440.
Gasket, £40
Headbolts £18
Various Seals £40
Other gaskets £40
Bearings £100.
Head pressure test and skim £100.
Management, DTA S40 £550.
Sandy Brown wiring loom, £300.
Sandy Brown Mapping £330.
Stock exhaust will suffice, or one like Miles's, £350.

________________________________________

need a part number? get on here - http://public.servicebox.peugeot.com

Bring on the Trumpets.

Posted 15th Oct 2012 at 20:21
honestly3k

Seasoned Pro

Location: Berkhamsted

Registered: 06 Apr 2009

Posts: 2,390

Status: Offline

Post #15
Doesnt include any labour for someone to put it together though does it? Pretty pricey but at the same time, similar costs to other options but arguably a better outcome.....

I think you just found your next project welshpug, your calling in life so to speak Big grin

________________________________________

''Oh, it does handle like a golf!'' Why drive a Golf....when you can drive a GTi-6?
Posted 15th Oct 2012 at 20:37
welshpug!

Capt Pedantic

Location: Bigend, Wales.

Registered: 27 Mar 2007

Posts: 25,817

Status: Offline

Post #16
why would I pay someone else to build my engine? LOL

________________________________________

need a part number? get on here - http://public.servicebox.peugeot.com

Bring on the Trumpets.

Posted 15th Oct 2012 at 21:02
eliotrw

Seasoned Pro

Location: Southwark

Registered: 18 Jul 2010

Posts: 4,864

Status: Offline

Post #17
So are you going that route then welshpug?

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Ex- Phase 3 China GTi-6 T-Reg
Posted 15th Oct 2012 at 21:11
daveyboy

aka Jim Davey

Location: Southampton

Registered: 01 Oct 2007

Posts: 8,648

Status: Offline

Post #18
Looks that way LOL

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Some of my services: (See my for sale threads)
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Posted 15th Oct 2012 at 21:19
si_batt

Newbie

Location: Warwick

Registered: 01 Jan 1970

Posts: 39

Status: Offline

Post #19
So in terms of re-mapping for the 2.1 conversion, can the original ecu be re-mapped, or is aftermarket the only option? On cars that I've had before, I've got away without re-mapping when I increased capacity, but I guess the 6 has MAP and TPS as opposed to a MAF and will not work as well on the standard map.
Posted 15th Oct 2012 at 21:34
eliotrw

Seasoned Pro

Location: Southwark

Registered: 18 Jul 2010

Posts: 4,864

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Post #20
daveyboy wrote:
Looks that way LOL

Kept it quiet :p

________________________________________

Ex- Phase 3 China GTi-6 T-Reg
Posted 15th Oct 2012 at 21:46
welshpug!

Capt Pedantic

Location: Bigend, Wales.

Registered: 27 Mar 2007

Posts: 25,817

Status: Offline

Post #21
who did? what? Huh?

________________________________________

need a part number? get on here - http://public.servicebox.peugeot.com

Bring on the Trumpets.

Posted 15th Oct 2012 at 21:59
eliotrw

Seasoned Pro

Location: Southwark

Registered: 18 Jul 2010

Posts: 4,864

Status: Offline

Post #22
I was just saying i didnt realise until now that you were rebuilding your engine (again?) as it wasnt 2.1 before the crash was it?

________________________________________

Ex- Phase 3 China GTi-6 T-Reg
Posted 15th Oct 2012 at 22:31
welshpug!

Capt Pedantic

Location: Bigend, Wales.

Registered: 27 Mar 2007

Posts: 25,817

Status: Offline

Post #23
I'm not going 2.1 LOL

________________________________________

need a part number? get on here - http://public.servicebox.peugeot.com

Bring on the Trumpets.

Posted 15th Oct 2012 at 22:51
roland rat

Yeeeah Rat fans!

Location: Swansea

Registered: 29 Nov 2006

Posts: 22,282

Status: Offline

Post #24
Mei's going 2.3 Ninja
Posted 15th Oct 2012 at 23:05
eliotrw

Seasoned Pro

Location: Southwark

Registered: 18 Jul 2010

Posts: 4,864

Status: Offline

Post #25
Shock Ninja .......EPIC

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Ex- Phase 3 China GTi-6 T-Reg
Posted 16th Oct 2012 at 10:28

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