Another 205 on Bodies, But with a S16 engine - General Forum - Peugeot 306 GTi-6 & Rallye Owners Club

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Subject: Another 205 on Bodies, But with a S16 engine

miles

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Location: Ringwood

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Post #1

Done this a while back with some good figures from basic bolt on mods, I will say these engine's are better to tune from these items than the 6 lump

Made 207bhp and 179 ft lb, From 45mm Bodies with Omex, My 4-2-1 manifold and system, Cat Cam's basic grind

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Posted 23rd Aug 2012 at 21:21

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fordygti

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Location: Walpole St Andrew

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Post #2

That's good. I got next to no gain on my standard 6 engine in my 306.

Am putting them on my 205 mi16 when its sorted

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Posted 23rd Aug 2012 at 21:38

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miles

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Post #3

That seems to be the way, I have a little test on another 6 engine I've installed which will be mapped in the next week or 2,
But most 1.9 Mi's you see a min of 180 with bodies

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Posted 23rd Aug 2012 at 22:48

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fordygti

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Post #4

Any reason for it? Or just the way the different engines work?

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Posted 23rd Aug 2012 at 23:20

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miles

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Post #5

Just the way they are along with old managment on the Mi's etc, the removal of all the AFM's and rubbish like that open up allot more than the 6.
Quite a few engine's like this, the old Zetec 2.0 16v Ford lump work's well on Bodies alone,

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Posted 23rd Aug 2012 at 23:28

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daveyboy

aka Jim Davey

Location: Southampton

Registered: 01 Oct 2007

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Post #6

The 6 is a highly developed evolution of the Mi16, it already has bigger valves, thiner valve stems, hotter cams and a better inlet and exhaust manifold, it's so good as standard that's why you don't see huge gains from bodies and cams. Until you make some major changes to the internals there isn't much more easy power to be unlocked with simple bolt on accessories.

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Posted 23rd Aug 2012 at 23:32

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welshpug!

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Post #7

Soo good, but still 10 bhp short of the ew10, and 30 on a k20 Wink

Though they are vvt/vtec engines.

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Posted 24th Aug 2012 at 05:39

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fordygti

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Post #8

I was pretty gutted really after the money the bodies, accessories, wiring and mapping cos to get next to nothing out of it.

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Posted 24th Aug 2012 at 10:47

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Matt_rallye

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Location: Bournemouth

Registered: 09 Jul 2012

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Post #9

Okay so bodies doesnt sound like a good route for a '6 then? What gains are had? 10-15bhp? I'm looking at cams, bodies, ecu with remap. Forced induction with a magnex stainless? Anyone hazard a guess?

Posted 24th Aug 2012 at 12:18

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roland rat

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Post #10

Matt_rallye wrote:

Forced indutction FTW!!!

Bang per buck you cant beat the supercharger conversion,even better if you can get a 2nd hand engine/kit/car with it already done.

Posted 24th Aug 2012 at 14:30

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fordygti

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Post #11

That's my plan supercharge the 306 and bodies on the 205.

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Posted 24th Aug 2012 at 17:48

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mattgti6phase2

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Post #12

So from the same mods what would you get from a 6 engine?

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Posted 24th Aug 2012 at 18:30

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welshpug!

Capt Pedantic

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Post #13

you wont be far off, however to get decent cams in the 6 engine you must allow for valve clearance which the std pistons don't.

push the envelope further however and the difference between the RFY and RFS engines don't seem so great, but as standard the older lumps have much greater valve clearance.

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Posted 24th Aug 2012 at 19:27

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eliotrw

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Post #14

welshpug! wrote:

Soo good, but still 10 bhp short of the ew10, and 30 on a k20 Wink

Though they are vvt/vtec engines.

Same torque as a k20 though or near enough? The revs are where the k20 gets its s**t. Not my cup of tea really type rs.

Is the ew in a 206 gti180. If so they seem pretty slow compared to my (probably down a few ponies) 6.
Either that or the bloke in pontypool/cwmbran with one doesnt know how to change gear. How heavy are those?

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Posted 25th Aug 2012 at 20:28

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welshpug!

Capt Pedantic

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Post #15

yeah the 180 is an ew, they outperform the XU's on torque and the EW10J4S in the 180 is 10 bhp up, or should be, and they weigh less than a 6, only 5 speed but a decent box.

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Posted 25th Aug 2012 at 20:51

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eliotrw

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Post #16

Hmmm maybe that bloke cant change gear then. Had a few plays with him and make him look silly everytime ! I like the engine in the 6 though. As far as a 2.0 16v with no form of vvt etc i think its pretty damn good Smile

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Posted 25th Aug 2012 at 21:18

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miles

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Post #17

Never had a 180 but I have heard allot do not make the quoted power, what do they weigh?

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Posted 25th Aug 2012 at 21:59

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pete_rallye

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Post #18

welshpug! wrote:

Soo good, but still 10 bhp short of the ew10, and 30 on a k20 Wink

Though they are vvt/vtec engines.

I can't think of any other non vtec/vvt 2.0 litre NA production engine that makes the same power as the gti-6, it really was/is a well designed engine for its time of production, hence why gains from itb's are moderate at best, the inlet and exhaust manifolds are already a great design. The real gains come from cams and a remap, wasn't it Rich_w who ,before all the SC stuff, had 208bhp from a set of PT81's and a remap? Just a shame that pocketed pistons are required to fit race cams, be interesting to see what it could make with eveything else standard...

Vvt engines are basically running 2 cam profiles, one mild for low down driveability and then what is effectively a race cam higher up the rev range to generate the power, it's all well and good, but there no point comparing vvt engines with non vvt, there as different as NA and turbo motors.

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Posted 25th Aug 2012 at 23:54

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eliotrw

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Post #19

Yeah. The thats how i feel about them really.
Imo an engine which doesnt get enough hype (only beacuse it was so rare) is the sr16ve(n1). I think it held the record for hp per litre before the S2000.
From wiki:
It made 200 PS (197 bhp)(147 kW) @ 7800 rpm and 134 lb·ft (181 Nm) @ 7600 rpm. Redline of the N1 Version 2 (1998) is at 8600 rpm. This is the most powerful production 1.6l Naturally aspirated engine. It was also the highest specific output of 1.6 naturally aspirated production of its time, until surpassed by the Honda F20C engine used in the S2000.

As a side not usually i hate aftermarket lights as a rule. But i really like those 205 ones. Are they dimma lights or something?

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Posted 26th Aug 2012 at 10:39

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welshpug!

Capt Pedantic

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Post #20

Just morettes, 180's kerb weight is 1125.

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Posted 26th Aug 2012 at 11:03

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24seven

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Post #21

pete_rallye wrote:

welshpug! wrote:

Soo good, but still 10 bhp short of the ew10, and 30 on a k20 Wink

Though they are vvt/vtec engines.

I can't think of any other non vtec/vvt 2.0 litre NA production engine that makes the same power as the gti-6

Focus ST170 had 171bhp, fixed timing. Wink

Ok so it did have variable length intake, but that's not what you talked about.

A better comparison of engines is their specific output, i.e. power per litre, in which case the D6C Mi16 scores better than the RFS, but then that was in the days before catalytic converters were fitted at the factory, where the book figure power tests were done.

[edit] Smart-arse fail... I think the 170 actually maybe potentially might have possibly had a variable timing intake cam... LOL

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Posted 27th Aug 2012 at 15:46

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