displaying posts 1 to 11 of 11

Author Subject: Another 205 GTI 6 Conversion
gordiflash

Newbie

Location: Hampshire/ Berkshire

Registered: 28 May 2011

Posts: 4

Status: Offline

Post #1
Hi everybody my name is Gordon and just joined up on here after scanning the threads for lots of info, thought i might aswell join up and post a thread in the hope that it might help someone else.
Im posting on here because as useful as the 205gtidrivers forum is, its hard posting things lol.

I have a 1.6 205gti '91. I have been thinking hard about wat to do with it and have now decided on a GTI-6 conversion. I chose the GTI-6 over the MI16 as getting an alloy block MI16 is getting harder and its as old or older then the car.
I finally decided that i need more power after having a little race with a friend who had a 106quiksilver 1.4 and there was nothing in it. the way i see it i should have been at least a little bit quicker. Besides that i have always wanted to build a sleeper and i love playing with cars Smile .

I have done quite alot of research over quite a few forums but am still unsure of what i need in some areas. i am trying to get everything i need together and going to try to do the whole conversion in one hit if possible.

so... i have the 205, i have bought an engine with unlocked ecu and this is my shopping list- Please correct me or point out anything else i might need..

- MI16 clutch

-Planning on using my 1.6 gearbox

- Thermostat adapter, thinking about buying the BakerBM gti6 hose kit which comes with adapter

- Re-angled exh manifold, buy or modify?

- Wiring loom, have contacted Spiky about one of his modified looms

- Throttle cable? do i need a longer one?

- Alternator mounting? do use the '5 alternator or the '6 one?

- Oil pressure adapter, ive seen a couple of people use it but dont know where to get it from?

- Exhaust, i have an exhaust system not fitted to the car but dont know how the fit is to the gti6 manifold opposed to the 1.6 manifold

Thats all i can think of atm but im sure there are more things and questions.

One more,
As far as i can work out you need to tilt the engine forward by shortening the lower engine mount in order to clear the master cylinder? and because of this u have to angle the exh fanimold? im a little bit confused by this part so any help is much appreciated.

as soon as i have anything worth taking a picture of then i will post them up.

Flash
Posted 2nd Jun 2011 at 01:07
coskev

Seasoned Pro

Location: Oswestry

Registered: 01 Nov 2009

Posts: 3,132

Status: Offline

Post #2
Welcome alongWink

You will need a 306 throttle cable,14 off the bay spankingSmile
Do NOT alter the angle of any engine mountsWhistle
Master cylinder to engine clearance can be a problem,best idea is to trim some out of the rear cambelt cover,then you could need to trim some off the rear of coilpack cover/cam cover,but its really only something you will find out once the engines in.
Get a set of BBM uprated engine mounts,if your engine is close to master cylinder they will help stop it touching.Wink
Re-angle your exhaust manifold or modify bulkhead,manifold is easier option.You can get them allready done for circa 100,or if you can weld apparently all you need to do is cut threw the exhaust manifold branches from underneath with a 5mm thick grinder disc,cut threw untill you can bend the exhaust down to take up the 5mm gap then re-weldSmile

________________________________________

Red GTB1756 powered Fabia VRS daily driver,LBSC Gti6 eater........

Mac1 ZR R1 kit car build in progress.
Posted 2nd Jun 2011 at 01:11
gman

Seasoned Pro

Location: Didcot

Registered: 25 Oct 2007

Posts: 1,458

Status: Offline

Post #3
You can get the oil pressure adapter from Miles (Pug Racing), and if you're running power steering, then just keep the standard alternator bracket and just get rid of the heavy a/c unit.

If you do this, you will also need what most people called a "rallye" set up that uses different tensioners.

Give the gearbox some thought. I remember on an old 1.6 I had that motorway driving was hell at 80mpg. There is also plenty of power for the 6 engine, so I would consider a longer gearbox such as the MI or Xsara VTS box.

________________________________________

1992 Onyx Black 205 GTI-6
2005 Honda S2000 (Sold)
2002 Audi S3 (Sold)
2005 Clio 182 Trophy (sold)
Posted 2nd Jun 2011 at 01:21
steve954

Seasoned Pro

Location: norwich

Registered: 16 Nov 2008

Posts: 2,213

Status: Offline

Post #4
gman wrote:
You can get the oil pressure adapter from Miles (Pug Racing), and if you're running power steering, then just keep the standard alternator bracket and just get rid of the heavy a/c unit.

If you do this, you will also need what most people called a "rallye" set up that uses different tensioners.

Give the gearbox some thought. I remember on an old 1.6 I had that motorway driving was hell at 80mpg. There is also plenty of power for the 6 engine, so I would consider a longer gearbox such as the MI or Xsara VTS box.
if you can get 80mpg with the 1.6 box then keep itWhistle

________________________________________

stevie
09 308 gt140 cc
03 octavia vrs

IF IT AIN'T BROKE, IT AIN'T A GTI6
Posted 2nd Jun 2011 at 02:53
gordiflash

Newbie

Location: Hampshire/ Berkshire

Registered: 28 May 2011

Posts: 4

Status: Offline

Post #5
Thanks for your input guys. really helpful!
have since done more research and am hunting a xsara vts 'box.
I need to spend a good day goin through all the pages i have saved of random lil bits of info and get it into some notes or something cos atm i loads of little bits of random info about the conversion floating about in my head and am starting to get lost in it all.
But anyway did some needed work over the weekend. I bought some Red stuff pads and grooved discs over a month ago but didnt want to fit them because both outer cv boots were goosed so got them done on saturday in the beating sun. after just the first 20 miles im well happy with them, not bee goin hard on them but the initial bite is fantastic. I dont know if thats just showing how poor my tired old pads and discs were or how good the EBC ones are lol.
And if my computer skills there should be a picture here......

Old ones...



Gucci new ones Smile

Thats it for the mo, Hopefully getting engine delivered tomorrow or this week Smile .

Little bit confused as to which clutch to use (push/ pull or voodoo type Unsure )
And if i need a vts driveshaft cup to run 1.6 shafts???? So confusing?!??!
Im sure once i sort all my info it will become alot clearer.

One more thing, my new Mirror charm, He uses the force to make me drive badly lol


Flash
Posted 7th Jun 2011 at 01:18
gordiflash

Newbie

Location: Hampshire/ Berkshire

Registered: 28 May 2011

Posts: 4

Status: Offline

Post #6
Oh..... how do i resize the pics lol Guess computer skills are not too great.
Posted 6th Jun 2011 at 04:41
205gti6_ro

Regular

Location: truro

Registered: 13 Apr 2009

Posts: 180

Status: Offline

Post #7
i'd change the brakes for at least 266mm if not gti6 283mm but you'd have to change the hubs as well.
Posted 6th Jun 2011 at 04:55
beez_neez_gt

Seasoned Pro

Location: @ de limit of adhesion !

Registered: 14 Oct 2008

Posts: 2,916

Status: Offline

Post #8
Hi,


Re-angled exh manifold, buy or modify? > Buy from Miles off ebay.

- Wiring loom, have contacted Spiky about one of his modified looms > Good

- Throttle cable? do i need a longer one? >Yes the 405 one is perfect as it can be attached to the pedal side of things. Best cable tie it behind the exhaust though or have it p clipped to the right hand side back cam cover, over the engine.

- Alternator mounting? do use the '5 alternator or the 6 one ? Use the 6 one, you can either use a cam belt tensioner under the belt attached to the engine mount bracket. Or like i have with a 6mm flat long bar with a long hole along the inside middle of it, so the alternator can bolt to it with pushing the alternator downwards then tension and bolt up.

- Oil pressure adapter, ive seen a couple of people use it but dont know where to get it
from ? > eBay again, Miles does the cheapest one around (mishor). You will need to use the 205 gti mushroom type shaped pressure sensor, then RTV it to the adaptor so no oil comes out. You can use a bolt or another sensor at the side of it.

The gearbox side of things well > If you want to keep the same driveshafts then you need to use the 205 gti diff with the VTS/GTI6 diffs main large diff drive cog onto the 205 inner diff. Use new seals and especially the one where the speedo housing bolts to the diff. Lots of peoples leak thinking its the shaft seals. Its a black circular one. Then use a 205 gti gear selector arm then the same clutch arm. Some other cars have the same ones as well. The dog leg shaped arm on top of the gearbox is the one that needs changing.

You also need the S16 speedo VSS where it has the plug and manual drive sensor in one, unlike the 205 gti one that has just the manual type.

No need to tilt the engine its a waste of time. Keep it natural and then either slot the servo holes over to the right so the servo is more to the right away from the cams. Every 205 is slightly different, some go straight in some are a pain, its down to the build differences. Yours might be fine like mine was. Or use washers with sealant between the bulk head and brake pedals/servo.

Best to keep the GTI6 brakes as bigger brakes are always safer, up to you.

Xsara VTS is almost the same gearing as the MI16 and is the most popular. 6 gearbox means you have less steering circle.

Use photobucket for pics its now has unlimited storage for free. You can change the setting so you can have small thumbnail pics that can be uploaded by others to see it bigger, Neater imo.

There's no doubt something iv missed, but thats about the most of the conversion.

Hope this helps

________________________________________

Pug fee`ver,

Pick a Bogey, buy a Pug.

Black 306 GTI 6 Standard, was 60k mileage, bargain!!

Clicky: [url =http://www.306gti6.com]click here[/url] remove the space between [url & =
Posted 6th Jun 2011 at 05:51
miles

Seasoned Pro

Location: Ringwood

Registered: 28 Dec 2002

Posts: 3,304

Status: Offline

Post #9
There's loads of misleading info out there as much as useful info so it can be a minefield if your not sure.

But good points above so to confirm

1. Re-angled Exhaust Manifold
2. Re-angled and shortened Downpipe + Lambda boss
3. VSS Sensor
4. Universal Acc cable kit (All Pugs use the same one) just cut to size
5. Adjust pedal box by spacing up or adjusting the holes, Some cars may need the back cam cover ground down slightly.
6. Loom, Worth having all the unused plugs removed on the engine, sensor loom re-routed and new Crimps used and not soldered with the Diag light fitted,
7. BBM Hose kit and stat adapter (nice to have)
8. 306 Battery Box (nice to have)
9. Clutch Kit, Mi16/BX16 as the GTi6 one is wrong
10. Gearbox, 205 ones direct fit (Unless early BE1), Xsara ones etc, Need diff and selector arm fitting along with cross shaft (Clutch arm) + Speedo drive wheels (Red & White/cream), Any BE driveshaft from a 205 will fit, only the hub end is different on the 1.6 to 1.9.
11. Brakes, larger ones will be a huge improvement over std, You can still keep the OE shafts if good with new hub's (1.6 ones have wrong offset)
12. Re-route fuel lines,
13. Normal service items, Belt, Pump, Oils etc

________________________________________

306 GTi5 Sptint/Race Car, 205 CTI 1.9 8v, 306 GTi6 x2 to name a few

306 GTi6 4-2-1 Stainless and mild steel Exhaust Manifolds
& Now Vibra Techic's mounts stocked

Road, Track and Race/Rally car preparation to your personal requirements,
Full Workshop & Diagnostic Facilities
New and Second parts, from Plugs to Turbo's
We now also carry out Routine Servicing
www.pugracing.com

& FB Page, https://www.facebook.com/PugRacing

2012/2013 Class Winners at Gurston Down Speed Hillclimb & Joint overall, Class record too along the way, 3rd in Modified Production too.
Posted 7th Jun 2011 at 03:14
gordiflash

Newbie

Location: Hampshire/ Berkshire

Registered: 28 May 2011

Posts: 4

Status: Offline

Post #10
Good news and bad news update.
Firstly thanks to everyone for your help, all the advice has just made me want to get it done.

Good news first, got the '6 engine on wednesday after missing the delivery on monday.
Pleased with it, couple of plugs broken on the loom but nothing major.
Was going to do the cambelt and water pump anyway but defo goin to after seein the
state of the cambelt cover bolts its been a while since it was off lol.

Bad news now.
yesterday someone decided to write off my poor 205 Sad sad Flash.
I was waiting to turn into Burgerking (lol) and guy behind me stopped but guy behind him
didnt, leading to two large bangs and me getting out of the car
shouting F*************************K!!!
quite a few times.

So the car is almost definatly a write off Sad and got whiplash and f***d back now

Dont know what to do now but have a gti6 engine now and have done the researc and still want to do it.
Luckily the lad who was in the passenger seat with me yesterday, has a sister with a mint 1.6 205
so might have a look into that lol.

Oh well thanks for everyones help.
I will put some damage pics up when i get a chance.

Flash
Posted 12th Jun 2011 at 22:18
judley

Regular

Location: Hartlepool

Registered: 25 Jan 2009

Posts: 228

Status: Offline

Post #11
That's a p*sser mate. Hope you get better soon and complete the conversion ;-)
Posted 12th Jun 2011 at 22:48

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